Check out on eBay UK:
290184366826
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Marston-Seagull-D ... dZViewItem
This is a DON, which I believe was one of the ON's but with a spring driveto a spring drive. This was an extra, I'm told, reflecting the importance of the spring to the company.
It seems probable that it's a genuine Marston, too, going on the serial, but of course there's no guarantee - dates and the like are still the subject of much debate.
I rather like this one.
I have to say that the early 102's - especially with that transom bracket, really do look the business. The supplier's nameplate sets it off nicely.
This will be interesting - particularly as the vendor has made it plain there's no 'buy it now' price, so it'll be a 'dead straight' auction with no jiggery-pokery.
This time, a complete one on the Bay!
Moderators: John@sos, charlesp, Charles uk, RickUK, Petergalileo
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Charles UK
I'd be very suprised if this is a Marston, Charles.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the DON later than the ON? so much so, that the spring drive prop is not mentioned in either of the post Marston, 1938 British Seagull brochures.
I admit it looks very clean all I can see that's not original, is the non plated SD fuel pipe.
Most of the early ONs that I have seen, seem have the Marston type pepper pot chokes.
Nice genuine transom bracket shame about the thrust pads, we're still trying to find someone who can cast us some in Birmabright, for less than a King's ransom.
It will be interesting to see how stupid the feeding frenzy gets on youpay.
Is there any way of finding out the JM number on this one & what is stamped on the prop?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the DON later than the ON? so much so, that the spring drive prop is not mentioned in either of the post Marston, 1938 British Seagull brochures.
I admit it looks very clean all I can see that's not original, is the non plated SD fuel pipe.
Most of the early ONs that I have seen, seem have the Marston type pepper pot chokes.
Nice genuine transom bracket shame about the thrust pads, we're still trying to find someone who can cast us some in Birmabright, for less than a King's ransom.
It will be interesting to see how stupid the feeding frenzy gets on youpay.
Is there any way of finding out the JM number on this one & what is stamped on the prop?
This time a complete one on the Bay
HAS CHARLES THOUGHT THAT THE FUEL PIPE JUST MAY HAVE BEEN STRIPPED OF THE FLAKING PLATING? I have 3 OA's, all have straight trumpet air intiakes, 3 OF's two pepperpots and one trumpet, 1 OJ has trumpet. I also have two SD's with trumpet. Who actually knows??
I was just wondering whether the prop spring and split pin are original or the throttle cable, spark plug, carb washers or the gear box grease for that matter are original??
Maybe this one is just worth a tenner!!!!
Love to know what John has to say on this.
Andy
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Charles UK
Andy,
The fuel pipes were polished before chrome plating, removing all the sharpish corners.
My Marston pile is 6 to 1 in favour of pepper pots.
I've seen pictures or the complete outboard of at least 60% + of all the known Marstons & pre war British Seagulls this give you a flavour of what it right.
The nice thing about this one is the pictures, that cover everything, all the "grey areas", right down to the right fuel tank, providing it doesn't have baffles.
The fuel pipes were polished before chrome plating, removing all the sharpish corners.
My Marston pile is 6 to 1 in favour of pepper pots.
I've seen pictures or the complete outboard of at least 60% + of all the known Marstons & pre war British Seagulls this give you a flavour of what it right.
The nice thing about this one is the pictures, that cover everything, all the "grey areas", right down to the right fuel tank, providing it doesn't have baffles.
Hmm, Charles is right, the tank shouldn't have baffles, but I'm confident this one is original, maybe we can confirm that it has none?
Andy is correct - the DON series - such as this one - are equipped with a spring drive from the factory. When they were converted is another matter - I have no idea. But they were allocated the separate letter code. I too have not seen one advertised in any brochure. There is another one close to where I'm sitting which has the 'trumpet' air intake, too. That one was sitting since the thirties in a local boat house, so the air intake was at the very least contemporary. I have a photo, but it's not to hand.
And yes, it's nice to be able to see the item in decent photos, there are quite a number of vendors who insist on an out of focus shot with the interesting bits obscured.
It's not long ago that eBay had a bracket similar to this one in someone's shop for £99.00, and there's a Marston tank on there right now in a shop for more than that. Just a thought.
The debate about 'is it a Marston' may continue, but we know that it's one of the 1937 onwards models that were produced initially by Marstons (before British Seagull were formed as a separate company). It'll be a long time before we have sufficient serial number (and JM number) evidence to completely nail it down.
For my own literary purposes I tend to refer to the ON series (and OP ) as 'Transitional Marstons' because they were originally produced by them in Wolverhampton, most of the components were Marston sourced in the beginning, and although British Seagull transfers began to appear on the petrol tanks they were otherwise the same thing.
The transfer between the two companies was a gradual thing, even the decals were identical save for the word 'Marston' being replaced by 'British. The brochures were in those days near as dammit identical, too, even to the extent of being printed by the Kynoch Press.
Bit of a moot point, really. The motors were, after all, designed by Pinniger and Way-Hope as they were proud to point out in their printed letter heads of the period.
Still a nice motor, not something that crops up every day on the Bay.
Andy is correct - the DON series - such as this one - are equipped with a spring drive from the factory. When they were converted is another matter - I have no idea. But they were allocated the separate letter code. I too have not seen one advertised in any brochure. There is another one close to where I'm sitting which has the 'trumpet' air intake, too. That one was sitting since the thirties in a local boat house, so the air intake was at the very least contemporary. I have a photo, but it's not to hand.
And yes, it's nice to be able to see the item in decent photos, there are quite a number of vendors who insist on an out of focus shot with the interesting bits obscured.
It's not long ago that eBay had a bracket similar to this one in someone's shop for £99.00, and there's a Marston tank on there right now in a shop for more than that. Just a thought.
The debate about 'is it a Marston' may continue, but we know that it's one of the 1937 onwards models that were produced initially by Marstons (before British Seagull were formed as a separate company). It'll be a long time before we have sufficient serial number (and JM number) evidence to completely nail it down.
For my own literary purposes I tend to refer to the ON series (and OP ) as 'Transitional Marstons' because they were originally produced by them in Wolverhampton, most of the components were Marston sourced in the beginning, and although British Seagull transfers began to appear on the petrol tanks they were otherwise the same thing.
The transfer between the two companies was a gradual thing, even the decals were identical save for the word 'Marston' being replaced by 'British. The brochures were in those days near as dammit identical, too, even to the extent of being printed by the Kynoch Press.
Bit of a moot point, really. The motors were, after all, designed by Pinniger and Way-Hope as they were proud to point out in their printed letter heads of the period.
Still a nice motor, not something that crops up every day on the Bay.
this time a complete one on thebay
The tank has no baffles.
Andy
Andy
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Charles UK
this time a complete one on the bay
Had a look this morning and the number on the DON flywheel rim is JM1828. And as a matter of interest I looked on the flywheels of the rest of my collection, all of them have JM with very low numbers, but two of the engines are not marked at all!
Had a look at the props, and the propellors of this type including trolling props have no marks whatsoever.
Andy
Had a look at the props, and the propellors of this type including trolling props have no marks whatsoever.
Andy
Regarding the air intakes -
I have in front of me a copy of the 1936/7 Marston brochure - which features an OJ as it's clutchless direct drive model, together with one other which I can only assume is the ON (the OP had a clutch if my memory serves). At least it looks like an ON. Clutch drive, rudder pintle, finned head, Mark II Marston bracket, etc
Both have trumpet air intakes - not a pepper pot in sight.
Mind you, I'm at a bit of a loss to explain why these two are in the catalogue -maybe my dates are a little screwy.
I'm trying to dig a little further into the JM number business, but that's not easy - there are a couple of difficult anomalies which I can't explain!
I have in front of me a copy of the 1936/7 Marston brochure - which features an OJ as it's clutchless direct drive model, together with one other which I can only assume is the ON (the OP had a clutch if my memory serves). At least it looks like an ON. Clutch drive, rudder pintle, finned head, Mark II Marston bracket, etc
Both have trumpet air intakes - not a pepper pot in sight.
Mind you, I'm at a bit of a loss to explain why these two are in the catalogue -maybe my dates are a little screwy.
I'm trying to dig a little further into the JM number business, but that's not easy - there are a couple of difficult anomalies which I can't explain!
DON Seagull
Certainly looks very original, maybe with the exception of the fuel pipe. However as there seem to be so many variables with these old motors it is difficult to tell.
My OA has the long trumpet of course. Promise to unearth it and check the JM numbers for you when I get time Charles!
Nice that yet another is being cared for though, £200 a fair price I thought.
My OA has the long trumpet of course. Promise to unearth it and check the JM numbers for you when I get time Charles!
Nice that yet another is being cared for though, £200 a fair price I thought.