Hand choke on ESC 123E5

bruce nickerson · Post by **bruce nickerson** » Fri Jul 10, 2009 9:24 pm

Have yet to get the starting liturgy for my ESC settled to enable the sacrament of easy starting. Many times it will only start when I put my hand over the venturi and have the throttle wide open. A variation on this is that it will cough a bit with the hand choke technique, then start with the next pull. Suggestions please? After warm, it will start normally with an occasional backslide into a need for the hand choke.

Vic · Post by **Vic** » Fri Jul 10, 2009 11:26 pm

What carb?
Access to the venturi implies a Villiers but according to the website an ESC has an Amal 416. The venturi of that would only be accessible if the air intake and choke were removed.

bruce nickerson · Post by **bruce nickerson** » Fri Jul 10, 2009 11:46 pm

My bad!!! It is a CPC. And it does have an Amal 416 carburretor, but the air intake/choke shutter is not attached- It is of cheap plastic (sorry!) and is broken, hence I am able to place my hand over where it used to be as described above!

Vic · Post by **Vic** » Sat Jul 11, 2009 12:32 am

You asked for suggestions. the obvious is to obtain and fit the proper air intake and choke assembly. All your starting prolems should then be over.

Still puzzled though becase the website says a CPC should have a Villiers carb.

Suggestion 2: obtain and fit a Villiers carb

Maybe with your hand over the venturi you are cutting off all the air. it wont start with no air. If you look at the diagram of the carb on the website you can see that there is a hole through the choke flap

Suggestion 3: bore a hole (about 3/16" ) through your hand

bruce nickerson · Post by **bruce nickerson** » Sat Jul 11, 2009 2:24 am

It is a CPCL crankcase, piston and crank, with an ESC block and head, bastardized sometime in the past. It has the Amal 416 carb. It ran reliably in this configuration last year without the air intake/choke assembly installed.

The problem recently is that it will start only when my hand blocks the venturi (this is possible because there is no air intake/choke assembly), the throttle lever is opened fully, and the engine is pulled with the starting cord once. While this is being done the engine will cough, if I withdraw my hand quickly enough from the venturi it will start. If it does not start with this pull, then another pull without my hand over the venturi usually does the trick. However, this procedure does not always work. What should I be checking?

40TPI · Post by **40TPI** » Sat Jul 11, 2009 4:36 pm

You do not mention having used the tickler on the carb to prime extra petrol when starting from cold.......

As Vic suggests, replacing the air-intake/choke will also make life easier than "faking" a choke effect with the hand.

Peter

bruce nickerson · Post by **bruce nickerson** » Sat Jul 11, 2009 6:07 pm

I do use the tickler. With the air intake/choke installed it will not start. Perhaps something weird like installation of needle, size of needle, etc? How can I tell what number needle is installed- is there a number on the base of the needle?

Post by **Charles uk** » Sat Jul 11, 2009 7:44 pm

There don't appear to be any other needles listed in the Seagull spares paperwork, so I assume there is only one needle type.

But the jets are numbered a 416 on a CPC I would expect to use a 95, if you unscrew the plastic float bowl the brass threaded jet is the bit the bowl was screwed on, on 1 side you will see Amal stamped on 1 of the other sides you will see a number, this is the jet size & the number refers to drips per minute.

If your carb ran perfectly last year it would imply that there is shit in the system somewhere, so clean everything out carb & all filters, fuel pipe & fuel tap.
If that doesn't cure it, let us know.