SD 102

[headdownarseup]

OK, seems i was wrong again! (i'm used to this by now)

But HOLY COW!!!, £65 is still twice what i originally paid for my SD a little over 4 years ago, and it was running well back then. Not now though

Price it seems rears its ugly head once again when it comes to getting one of these old dears back into running condition again.
Fair enough if you can afford to throw £65 at it in the hope it gets things back to where it should be. But some of us find £65 a bit too much for a coil. PLUS there's still the dreaded VAT to be added which takes the final price to £78. This is the point where some of us run scared and give up with seagulls forever.
I think i speak for a fair few of us on a shoestring budget so perhaps you can understand why we look for alternative solutions at a more affordable price.
I'm just being honest here, i can't just chuck money at it willy nilly, and maybe several other seagull owners can't either. Not at that price anyway.
But i would like to get it working again, but for a lot less than £78 if it's possible. You can't blame me for trying.

Maybe Charles could explain what the design differences are with the 4 pickups. I have absolutely no idea why 4 pickups are better than 2 in a JM.
My little brain hasn't got the capacity to work it out any more. Sorry...


Jon

[Charles uk]

When you said you had it sussed I thought you were about to give us a positive contribution to the mystery that surrounds these Villiers coils, sadly not the case.

I can't offer much help either, guesses are not what we're after, as my role is to keep things as accurate as possible for the members & all the guests that visit us, we know from previous discussions that the Villiers 1030x16 & the Mk 1 coil are similar in the number of turns & wire gauges used but differ slightly in the layer layout.

The member who performed this research for us many years ago, hasn't been seen on here for a long time, so we can't ask him, but he did say at the time that when Villiers designed the 1030x16 it was a very clever bit of work & that they certainly knew what they were doing, as many of them are still working after a fashion & they're at least 70 years old.

Did you get my email address Jon?

[Hugz]

When I received a price to have an SD coil rewired the old timer asked that I supply the backing plate so that he can match the condensor to the coil.

Are the condensor from the JM mag the same as Villiers MK1?

Here is an interesting thread: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1552&hilit=coil+rewind

[Charles uk]

Nice bit of research Hugz, I wonder how Timberman, Woodbutchergraham & 40Tpi are doing, you always felt they were smiling when typing, gentlemen.

[Oyster 49]

Yes, we often forget the good work that was done on this forum in the early days. Shame the photos were lost. Most if not all of the originals (I dont include myself in that) are still around.

I'd advise anybody to spend some time looking through the older posts. Some great information there.

Re the cost of stuff, I don't see how anybody wishing to restore a 1930s or 1940s engine can expect to do it properly on a shoestring. It's still a generally cheap hobby, particularly if you compare to classic motorcycles!

£78 for a new coil that will make your engine 100% reliable is not bad actually.

[Keith.P]

You can do them on a shoestring. Maybe not the Marston, as a good one is just an expencive wall hanger. However, the 1940s motors - why should you change the coil if it works? If you are just poodling down the river, thats fine. If you are going out to sea, even with a new or old coil fitted, then I would think you were daft.
I had a dead coolie coil. I got another coil/base plate off Ebay; same coil, different engine. £10 later I have a working ignition, no guarantees. Just like a new coil, no guarentee.
You can put a new coil on every old motor, but how often will the motor see water other then a water butt for most people.

The adage on this site has always been, "if it's not broken why fix it?"

[headdownarseup]

Charles you surprise me. There was me (and possibly others) thinking that you were the "all knowing" when it comes to anything with a coolie magneto.
Yes i have your email address Chas.


I'm with Keith on this. If you look (and i really do mean look carefully and ask questions) you can buy a bargain. Not wishing to blow my own trumpet here but £35 for my SD a few years ago, admitted it still needs a bit of work, but i'd call that a bargain compared to what's gone up for sale in recent months. How and why the coil has suddenly given up the ghost is beyond me as it was working very well last year! I put it down to being 75 years old.
Less than £50 for a working FV, again a work in progress.
True, some you win, some you loose. All depends on what takes your fancy at the time.

Patience helps too. I'm not in any great rush to fulfill my deepest desires when it comes to seagulls. I just look and observe. I set myself a limit at what i want to pay and that's that.

I suppose that eventually i probably will end up buying a few new coils from somewhere, but i think i speak for a great many people across the uk hard at work in their sheds trying desperately to get a spark from an ancient coil or some other mundane task with these older machines. I'm just a skinflint at heart so perhaps my methods may not be to your liking at times, i understand that. But credit where credit is due. Some of us have come up with some "real word" ways of getting around some age old problems with these engines. Don't knock it till you try it. Just because some of us regulars might not have a well equipped workshop doesn't mean we can't get around certain problems. Recycle and re-use is often a watchword of mine. You can buy a bargain, trust me on that. Even with shallow pockets and a nagging wife!

Jon

[woodbutchergraham]

Im still here lurking in the back ground, Hope everyone is well. Last checked my SD still working needs a bit of tweaking but still going strong. Unlike me lol
Graham

[Oyster 49]

Good to hear from you Graham

[Hugz]

Hope your health is improving Graham. Any chance l can have your SD particulars for the registry? I can send off a questionnaire if you can pm me your email addy. Marvelous motors....

It would be good Jon if l can get those motors on the previous registry so l don't harass owners that have already contributed their details.... thanks.

Incidentally on two of the early SD's (ie under a thousand) a second number has come to light on the crankcase same position as engine number but opposite side. So far it is a 4 digit # starting with the letter B dot. Any info on this phenomenon?

Cheers, Hugo

[seagull101]

Hugo, Did you get my email address? Also PM'd you Jon.

Jacob

[Hugz]

Yep, I sent you an email. I'll do another.

[seagull101]

Have just been reading up on coils.

So assuming my one is bad could I somehow fit a standard Villiers coil under the flywheel or do I have to find one for sale??
Also is there a chance that the points are dirty and the coil is fine, or do these all go wrong?

Jacob

[Charles uk]

All of these questions have already been answered several times in the past, have a good search, you'll be surprised with what you'll learn, answers to questions that you haven't thought of yet.

Clean & set your points twice & check for a spark, you might be lucky!

[AusAnzani]

Congratulations haventaclue, it will look nice on the rack beside the other.

Oyster, that is a beautiful SD you have there.

Regards,
S