How many man hours..?

[charlesp]

I recently purchased a Silver Century. I didn't pay too much for it, there was no opportunity to see it running nor even to see if it had a spark. It was clean enough, all the bits were there and it had lots of compression.

When I got it home it naturally found its way to the test tank and after a quick swill through of the fuel system I was pleased to discover it started on the second pull, and revved freely.

No water, however. Not a problem, I thought. Whip the block off and dig the muck out.

I managed to shear three of the cylinder head studs, and only managed to extract two of those, so a fair amount of time and patience was expended on that one stud. I also managed to shear off the brass water pipe union - more time.

I thought I'd replace the HT lead while I was at it, and managed to wind the small stud off the baseplate flush with the surface. I have to say I've never had a motor that was so awkward in terms of reasonable looking fasteners that proved to be a complete pain.

The assembled bit and spares are waiting on the bench for a reassembly that I am confident will produce a working Century in good condition, and by the time I have finished the whole thing will have taken me a couple of man days in total - all for a motor that doesn't have a huge value in the first place.

It's come to my attention recently that there are people around who will undertake to strip and clean the muck out of a Seagull for around £30 on a fixed price basis; I can't help wonder how on earth this job can be guaranteed to take the couple of hours or thereabouts that would render this economically feasible - am I missing something?

How many man hours do you reckon it takes to completely strip, clean, reassemble, adjust, test etc a Seagull? And how many hours if you're going to brush the scale off all the castings, respray the flywheel, block, prop and gearbox?

Based on the unbelievable quote I have recently seen for replacing the top bearing in a small Mariner it's pretty obvious that marine motor engineers would be charging into the hundreds of pounds for the job.

Any thoughts?

[Colin]

I've never actually kept track of the hours. I just finished a Century Plus full restoration that I'm sure took me well over several hundred hours.

I just sold a Forty Plus and promised it would be running and ready for marine service when the buyer took possession; certainly a full afternoon was spent checking the engine completely and replacing common ware parts.

I'm not sure that very much could or would be done for thirty pounds. Perhaps its a bit of a come-on, like the free brake check; no one ever left the garage without spending money for all the other parts of the car found defective while doing the FREE check.

[Ian Malcolm]

For £30 one expects that they probably just flush the gearbox out with a solvent spray, put oil in, (probably not even 140 weight), turn upsidedown, squirt the water jacket full of brick cleaner acid from the builder's merchant , and let it sit a bit and back flush it.

I'd lay odds that if you put tiny dabs of clear nail varnish on the edge of the head of every fastener they'd need to remove to do a proper job, none of them would be cracked afterwards. The fuel system would *not* have been cleaned properly and odds are that if you left a bit of coloured thread or lint in the float bowl it would still be there.

Charles, you certainly had bad luck with that Silver Century. If someone else broke three studs and the water pipe union, we'd be thinking they were cackhanded but even if you were having a really bad day, it seems iimprobable that *you* would be careless. Did you do anything different or take any special measures to undo the stuck fastenings?

[twostrokenut]

Difficult one to answer , I suspect Charles that the £30 "spruce up" would not be to the standard of workmanship of which you would require.
The old saying "if you want something done properly , then do it yourself" really comes into our hobby.
I would say with the studs etc , you were just unlucky , it's happened to me before , and no doubt will do again.............I hope that makes you feel a tiny bit better.

Andy.

[charlesp]

Nothing different...

Soaked, plenty of heat, careful with a shortish spanner; all that.

Thanks for letting me cry on your shoulders!

I'm glad others take hours and hours - I know I'm slow in my old age but I'm sure the comments about a quick flush must be close to the mark.

This is exactly the reason that so few people mend Seagulls for a living - assuming you charge anything close to a reasonable hourly rate that'll keep the wolf from the door then the job isn't financially viable.

Didn't get the Century assembled today - despite retirement I still have trouble finding enough spare hours out of the day to do the things I want!

[Charles UK]

This must be a first Charles, I agree with you 100%.

I've cleaned several solid water jackets before I realised that it was much cheaper in time to replace it with good one from a less desireable motor.

Now I only clean cylinders that are impossible to replace by any other means & that is only war time 102,s & Marstons.

I'm forced to belive that British Seagull base their price of a new cylinder, on the time it takes to recondition a very tired one.

The "fully restored" expression that some people use, to describe their for sale items, always make me want to ask the following questions,
Main bearings,
Gearbox bearings,
Con rod,
Gearbox thrust washers,
Piston rings.

So what they really mean to say is, cleaned the crap off it & fitted new spark plug.

Though I have seen ones that John has rebuilt & I'm sure they would look real good on my engine rack & I could make room no trouble.

So should we use the following levels of restoration codes

5, Cleaned with old fuel.

4, Cleaned, new spark plug, topped up gear oil.

3, the previous & painted fuel tank & cylinder black, drive shaft tube & lower unit silver.

2, all the above with a water slide fuel tank logo, a new fuel tap cork, & a new throttle cable.

1, a FULL restoration bringing it back to an "as new" or better condition cosmetically & mechanicaly including rechroming the drive shaft tube.

Please excuse the speling it's geting late;

[charlesp]

Good idea.

Like to see how many hours are involved in a Grade 1...