Saving Old Seagulls

Hi all, picked up this AD 102 in September in the box and all happy as or is the box a coffin? Anyhow this motor ran great in the tank pumps heaps of water etc. Put it on my tinny - Sea Slug-( by the way it was already named that when I bought it just a coincidence) for the motors maiden voyage Everything was going well, running good, enough speed I think? WHEN I was a few Kilometres from the ramp I came across lots of jellyfish in the water and as you do you hit a lot of them with your prop which was making the motor labour a bit then clank a horrible noise from the crank and seize. After rowing back to the ramp which near killed me I got home and did the most important thing first and had a beer. After a severely needed drink the next thing I did was pull out the spark plug for a look and even though the fuel was the correct mix of 10:1 - 100ml per 1 litre of fuel - this is what I found the spark plug was not oily at all? The adventure begins
cheers Bob

Dumb qustion.... Is the engine still seized? Do you think anything is broken??
Or was it a case of overheating due to lack of water (Jellyfish don't work well as cooling water)

Hi Nudge, the motor does rotate but there is a clunking sound coming from the motor. I suppose seize was the wrong choice of words on my part sorry. When I got home I washed it down and reverse flushed it with the garden hose and water flowed easily. When I rotate it by hand it will do a rotation and feels like there is some compression but on next cycle it locks up (clunk) and I have to rotate backwards then forwards to continue the turn.
Cheers
Bob

It sounds like you've got something that's very broken!

It's going to have to come to bits, to find out which end is causing the problem.

As for the name of the tinny, I drove a hydroplane in NZ that when they knew a Pomme would be driving it, was named "Septic Tank", apparently a reference to the contents. I thought that was very respectful.

Maybe Nudibrank would look smarter on yours.

As Charles says, its all just speculation, your going to have to be stripped down to find the problem.
Obviously it got too hot, which could point to, worn bushings, of just bad water flow, either was it can be fixed.

yes a quick strip down and a look see to find out what has been going on. Do keep us informed and plenty of photos please

I'm no expert, but i'd say the colour of the plug was about right. (they're not always oily) Just a couple of weeks ago i ran my little EGF hard and fast on the canal for 10 minutes, and once it was back home i took the plug out for a look see. It was in pretty much the same condition as yours.

Now this clunking sound!
I've had a similar situation with an AC of mine where part of the counter weight on the crankshaft had separated and got stuck inside the hollow part of the piston. I try and get in the habit of turning the flywheels on my gulls by hand every once in a while, especially when they're in storage for months on end. I was doing exactly this when i came across a nasty CLUNK and the flywheel locked up. It was when i stripped the crankcases apart that i found this little bit of metal had got stuck inside the piston causing the lock up. It can happen i suppose with a lot of these 102's that havn't been kept in running order for months or even years on end. These balance weights are welded directly onto the crankshaft itself and over time corrosion sets in and weakens the weld.
Either way a strip down will be needed to confirm what's going on with it. You'd be wise to look over every nook and cranny in the cylinder too. Clean out the waterjacket whilst you're in there and give everything a once over.
Leave nothing to chance. It could come back and bite you harder the next time.

Jon

Hi pulled down the motor to see what is wrong and surprisingly enough everything came apart easily. Then hang on a minute everything is moving freely - in and out .
Whoops started at the wrong end. Anyhow, I then grab the gearbox and find it is the problem not the motor take it apart and there it is a stuffed pinion. I would have swore blind the noise was coming from the top of the outboard
something else I noticed is the crown gear looks like it is from a clutched gearbox and mine is direct drive. Is there a problem there? Are the pinion and crown gear the same ratio? Is that why it flogged out or was it already had it and me with my unlimited mechanical knowledge (not) didn't see it when I cleaned the dry rubbish out of the gearbox and put oil in it etc. when I first got it. I have another question as well - the driveshaft appears to be bonded somehow to the vertical shaft at the gearbox near the water pump rotor probably rust. Would it be wise to use heat on the driveshaft to release it from the other or would that weaken the driveshaft material? Oh yeah since I have it apart how do you clean the water jackets on a 102 I see a big screw on the side of the head has that got anything to do with it or do I separate the head from the crankcase? I really don't want to pay for a new head gasket if I can get away with it. Anyway I learnt a good lesson with this little escapade - start with things the motor is connected to first and work your way up to the motor.
All good this end
Cheers
Bob

AD use the the same crown gear for clutched and direct drives. I'm assuming there was a bit of end play ie in and out of the prop shaft which caused the gears not to mesh well. If this be the case the shim washer/s were worn (next to back plate).

didn't see it when I cleaned the dry rubbish out of the gearbox and put oil in it etc.

Did you take the gearbox apart when you cleaned it out? Did you put the thrust washer/ shim back in? Has it got a thrust washer? if there is no washer, then that will more than likely be the cause of destruction!

If your looking for an old 102 direct drive gearbox i might be able to help,
Post a picture of your box, and i will look in the seagull stuff.
I might cost you a hours drive south to Logan City, but it might get you fixed.

Bob
Send me a pm and i will try and talk you through a few things.


Jon

Hi THC thanks for the offer to help a different gearbox to suit will save a lot of work that's for sure. This is a photo of the gearbox when I first pulled if apart when I got the motor in September lots of rubbish inside it then. I'd appreciate it if you have a look at what you've got and maybe find something similar. A drive to Logan is far easier than getting one online that's for sure.

This is a perfect example of what can happen if the meshing of the crown wheel & pinion is not set correctly, by adjusting the thrust washer thickness.
It can also be caused by changing the propshaft for another used one with different wear patterns on the crown wheel gear teeth.

This box is now beyond economic repair, as it probably needs a pinion shaft, pinion bearing, gasket, prop shaft, crown wheel, two prop shaft bearings & 3 or 4 various thickness thrust washers, getting on for £200 in new parts, at a guess.

The moral of this story is, if you can hear any noise from the lower unit other than exhaust noise, it could be the funeral march!

Does THC stand for trihydro something or other?