Forty series is this a Wipac 2 fault?

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african imp
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Re: Forty series is this a Wipac 2 fault?

Post by african imp » Sun Jan 20, 2019 11:44 am

tambikeboy wrote:Ok your getting spark but no notice of fuel on the plug now about trying the carb from your working motor change parts between the 2 of them untill problem is solved..china

Thanks,


I have tried that and with no result!

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Hugz
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Re: Forty series is this a Wipac 2 fault?

Post by Hugz » Sun Jan 20, 2019 12:55 pm

You might have 2 problems so maybe change magneto and the carb. That century you showed us. If it is running change the carb and mag from that. If still no good change the cylinder. Maybe a crack from bore to tranfer port though l would still think you would get some form of combustion. The drill start might be your last resort. The different magnetos are all interchangeable as a set.

african imp
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Re: Forty series is this a Wipac 2 fault?

Post by african imp » Sun Jan 20, 2019 1:58 pm

Hugz wrote:You might have 2 problems so maybe change magneto and the carb. That century you showed us. If it is running change the carb and mag from that. If still no good change the cylinder. Maybe a crack from bore to tranfer port though l would still think you would get some form of combustion. The drill start might be your last resort. The different magnetos are all interchangeable as a set.

Thanks,


I have tried the carb from the Century, that has a Villiers coil so no chance to swop that.

I do have a spare Wipac coil.


As the motor is now I have a spark at the plug anyway.


I have no Forty size cylinders at all.


John at SOS says try the Low Tension line next?

african imp
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Re: Forty series is this a Wipac 2 fault?

Post by african imp » Sun Jan 20, 2019 2:00 pm

Wipac 2 units, would painting the flywheel affect the output?

It was originally painted and inside and out, I removed the old paints, applied etch primer then top coat in new gold, it should be old gold?
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Hugz
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Re: Forty series is this a Wipac 2 fault?

Post by Hugz » Sun Jan 20, 2019 11:44 pm

It is hard to follow this problem as it has a few threads. Is the motor in water and if so how high is the water? Maybe too high causing difficult in breathing. I think a lot of us have experience enough of these motors that we can 'feel' what is right. Without actually being able to feel the rope pulling on the sheave it is difficult to comment. If it was mine and l have spark l would be try to start it out of water. I would also try different spark gaps ie close it down a bit to say 16°. Each motor runs a little different. I would check your fuel, any water in it? How long do you pull the motor, how many wraps around the pulley? How fast and hard do you pull it. Way to many variables. Can you make a video please showing as much as you can when starting. Are you an enthusist or a trader? This is beginning to annoy me.

croweater
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Re: Forty series is this a Wipac 2 fault?

Post by croweater » Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:13 am

Wow what a headache, its happened to many of us there is usually a reason. After checking your posts looks like you
have tried almost everything.
Compression; As the power head has compression and you have not pulled it apart I would think it would be ok unless
this motor had an issue before it came into your possession (crankcase leak,wrong parts etc.)
Ignition; Wipac are the most reliable but they have let me down a couple of times, coil and a condenser (which is built
into the coil). I see you have changed plugs (I use D16 and had no issues) was the spark between the electrodes? You
cleaned and reset the points, the gap is correct? As you have good spark I think it is not an ignition issue.
Fuel; I saw in another post you had a blocked fuel tap (the worst I have seen) was it from this motor? The carby was
cleaned and looks like it has been bead blasted, was the carb dismantled 100% including the centrepiece & jet and
centrepiece washer then cleaned afterwards? Check fuel flow to the carb, check flow into the bowl, check cap vent.
I would put the carb back to how it was including the 10-1 needle.
Good luck John

african imp
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Re: Forty series is this a Wipac 2 fault?

Post by african imp » Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:14 am

With the advice from more than one forum member, plus the Search function I have learned how to test the Wipac coil.


John at SOS told me that a reading of 3500 to 4500 Ohms was good, I later found out from him that 5000 Ohms is even better, The one on my none starting reads 5.0 Ohms on the meter.

I have now tested three of my Seagull motors plus a spare that came with a job lot crate of Seagull parts.

All are good, even the one on the 102 Powerhead I have !

The crankcase half was one of the parts in the job lot, cleaned off I find it to be near new, I have the other half as well.

Note, the Multimeter that I have reads as 3.5, 4.5 or 5.0 etc,
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african imp
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Re: Forty series is this a Wipac 2 fault?

Post by african imp » Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:08 am

croweater wrote:Wow what a headache, its happened to many of us there is usually a reason. After checking your posts looks like you
have tried almost everything.
Compression; As the power head has compression and you have not pulled it apart I would think it would be ok unless
this motor had an issue before it came into your possession (crankcase leak,wrong parts etc.)
Ignition; Wipac are the most reliable but they have let me down a couple of times, coil and a condenser (which is built
into the coil). I see you have changed plugs (I use D16 and had no issues) was the spark between the electrodes? You
cleaned and reset the points, the gap is correct? As you have good spark I think it is not an ignition issue.
Fuel; I saw in another post you had a blocked fuel tap (the worst I have seen) was it from this motor? The carby was
cleaned and looks like it has been bead blasted, was the carb dismantled 100% including the centrepiece & jet and
centrepiece washer then cleaned afterwards? Check fuel flow to the carb, check flow into the bowl, check cap vent.
I would put the carb back to how it was including the 10-1 needle.
Good luck John

John, Thanks for your posting, I have swoped the carb over for another one and with no success, The Wipac reads 5.0 Ohms which I am told is good.

Various plug leads have been tried.

Pouring fuel mix into the engne with the carb removed did nothing.

Four plugs used, that includes a new Champion D16.

The points have been cleaned with alcohol as per the handbook, then set to 0.5mm , there is a spark at the plug anyway.

Right now i suspect that fuel is not reaching the spark plug but I have no idea why?

This engine came to me in 2017 and was a none starter then, it was on the standard 10:1 petrol to 2 stroke mix then.

african imp
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Re: Forty series is this a Wipac 2 fault?

Post by african imp » Mon Jan 21, 2019 11:26 am

Wipac 2 issue, it may well be?

In 2017 I gave up on this motor, this time I am trying not to, as it really is a nice British Seagull and may well have low hours on it.

At some time in the past it stopped running and what the cause was could not be found?

I have just powered the engine up with an electric drill, as soon as the flywheel starts so does a nice blue spark but as the revs pick up the spark stops, so that is why I cannot start this motor !

What to check again is now the question .
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croweater
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Re: Forty series is this a Wipac 2 fault?

Post by croweater » Mon Jan 21, 2019 1:05 pm

You have checked the secondary windings but in the Wipac MkII the condenser is built into the coil I have had one
fail. Easiest way to check is to change the Wipac baseplate assembly with one off your good motors, even the Villers
complete unit will fit. If it fires up then replace the coil.

This is what happened to me on a long run post 175 the second coil I suspect was the condenser that died.
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=4464&p=36256#p36256
Good luck
John

african imp
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Re: Forty series is this a Wipac 2 fault?

Post by african imp » Mon Jan 21, 2019 2:10 pm

I have a spare Wipac coil, using the power drill as the method to torn the flywheel and changing over from the original Wipac that was on the engine brought me a nice fat spark and in a constant fashion.
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african imp
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Re: Forty series is this a Wipac 2 fault?

Post by african imp » Mon Jan 21, 2019 2:13 pm

With the flywheel nut re tightened and the start rope fitted, fuel tap on with the fuel bowl full, I set the choke and turned the throttle to full power.

The engine started first pull and ran perfectly :P
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african imp
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Re: Forty series is this a Wipac 2 fault?

Post by african imp » Mon Jan 21, 2019 2:14 pm

Do I have a Wipac 2 fault? yes I did but not anymore.

Guys, my sincere thanks for those who chipped in and gave me advice, it all helped in the end.
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Hugz
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Re: Forty series is this a Wipac 2 fault?

Post by Hugz » Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:20 pm

Excellent news. What is the next project? Always good to keep it to one thread. We read them all. It is rare that the wipac fails so l wouldn't think a spare coil is required. Re motor bike using wipac mag think of motor bikes built in 1967 or later with a single cylinder. Maybe a lawnmower or concrete mixer, stationary engine etc

croweater
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Re: Forty series is this a Wipac 2 fault?

Post by croweater » Tue Jan 22, 2019 1:01 am

Well done there would have be quite a cheer when it fired. The Hillman in the background of some of your photos
reminds me of an interesting blog I came across 4 or 5 years ago, is that you?

Hugz coils are half a century old now. Can picture you riding an old BSA Bantam smoke cloud drifting behind :lol:
guessing then you bought the Transit van.
John

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