GFP 40+ starts but won't get going

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Charles uk
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Re: GFP 40+ starts but won't get going

Post by Charles uk »

Save all crud you extract from the water jacket, then weigh 5 grams & leave in strong caustic for a week & wash clean dry & weigh again, & the same with a dish washer tablet, it would be nice to know how well these recommendations dissolve rust when in very close contact.
Make it idiot proof and someone will make a better idiot.
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Collector Inspector
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Re: GFP 40+ starts but won't get going

Post by Collector Inspector »

Shamba wrote:As promised some pictures; here she is head and tank removed.
IMG_2233.JPG
IMG_2231.JPG
Note the new stainless clamps and "hook" from SOS.

I got round to removing the head this lunchtime having sprayed everything in penetrating oil for a couple of evenings. Came apart easy with no heat required.
IMG_2226.JPG
To my un-tutored eye the head looks okay. No carbon at all. The bore looks clean also with no obvious scores.
IMG_2229.JPG
The water jacket looks pretty solid with rusty gunk so well worth getting the head of and having a poke around in there.

I also noticed for the first time (unless i broke it when I broke the transom screws) that the drive spring is broke...so another item on the shopping list.
IMG_2225.JPG
More to follow....

ps not sure why the pictures have become rotated but I'll try to keep things on an even keel in future.


Welcome aboard with your Gull. You have "Help From on High" so continue as you go..........FUN!

Seriously in that I have been waiting with Bait on My Breath to see..........head off and NO evidence of RTV. The copper gasket marks show sealing in all of the correct places around water passage and chamber seal lands. Just like magic BS engineering did work!

I appreciate this state as "Original"

Your motor and pics head, gasket and top of block so far? OUTSTANDING Thank You.

Gentlemen.......I rest my case!

This will go back together like Rolls Royce.....no effort whatsoever.

Keep pics coming Mate!

Cheers

BnC
A chicken is one egg's way of becoming others
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Oyster 49
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Re: GFP 40+ starts but won't get going

Post by Oyster 49 »

The caustic solution or dishwasher tablets were a suggestion for giving the tank a final clean out. For waterways a more physical presence is the only way.

The other good way to clean a tank out is to remove the tap to protect the mesh filter, then put some gravel in the tank and shake around for a while. Do that before the caustic soak.

Anyway, it looks like this one is well on the way!

My garage used to look like that until I had a monster clear out..hope the landy goes well. I've always fancied a SWB soft top.
haventaclue
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Re: GFP 40+ starts but won't get going

Post by haventaclue »

I have a corner in my garage where the bike can sit :lol: .When you cleaned the carb,did you blow it through with compressed air? It really helps
John Hayes
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Re: GFP 40+ starts but won't get going

Post by John Hayes »

The bing carb has a round gauze filter which seems to develop a clear membrane over it, preventing fuel from flowing after start-up. Remove this filter and clean thoroughly so you can see through all parts of the filter. I had the same trouble with two bing equipped 40s.
Worth a try. :?:
Shamba
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Re: GFP 40+ starts but won't get going

Post by Shamba »

Not a lot of progress to report I'm afraid but I thought I'd share what there is.

This is the sort of crud I've been digging out
IMG_2243[1].JPG
and as you can see there are now some visible cooling galleries, although I think I have a way to go before they're clear.
IMG_2245[1].JPG
My next questions are regarding the HT lead that I'm advised to replace. Here it is (note that the plug cap is cracked unfortunately for the bakelite lovers amongst us)
IMG_2247[1].JPG
I have a new plug cap and want to change the HT lead as well. I have some new HT lead and s plug cap but how to I get the magneto end attached. My understanding of earlier comments was that it would unscrew but application of reasonable force has failed to effect any dismantling.

Does this thing....
IMG_2249[1].JPG
....come off so I can make up a new cable
IMG_2251[1].JPG

or not?
haventaclue
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Re: GFP 40+ starts but won't get going

Post by haventaclue »

Yes it does,you need to remove the pin from the spring,very carefully,then insert a very fine screwdriver and undo the wee screw that holds the spring and cable in place
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Oyster 49
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Re: GFP 40+ starts but won't get going

Post by Oyster 49 »

If you look at the end of the HT lead that goes into the magneto, you will see a brass contact with a small Spring underneath. Carefully pull the brass connector out and you will see a small screw where the bottom of the spring sits. Undo that screw and the HT lead will come out. Refers the proces with a new length of HT lead, and when it is all assembled do a quick continuity test with the meter. Job done.

Looks like you are well on your way with the water jacket.

Key thing to remember is getting the fuel system as clean as possible, from carb to tank.

Good work so far :P
Shamba
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Re: GFP 40+ starts but won't get going

Post by Shamba »

Fantastic. Thanks guys. I'll keep you posted on progress.

Steve
Shamba
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Re: GFP 40+ starts but won't get going

Post by Shamba »

Success. That happened exactly as described
image.jpg
Allowing me to assemble a new ht lead thus
image.jpg
Thanks guys. Couldn't have done it without you 8)
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John@sos
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Re: GFP 40+ starts but won't get going

Post by John@sos »

Who the heck sold you an HT lead without the inboard end? Or maybe you were just making a new one on the cheap!

Well done if you stripped and rebuilt that inboard end without the spring going out of shape!

By the way, do not use the metal clip on the HT lead outer end on the plug, a driop of Sikaflex or Silicone will stop it falling off and seal it.. the clip just goes red rusty. If you really think you need a clip, use a small black cable tie.

That suppressor in the lead dates the lead to 1978. it was a diasyer for Seagull they had to scrap thousands and replace loads.

The steel screws on the end of the suppressor get one sniff of salt air and go rusty, rust is an excellent insulator!

Amazingly I still find loads of Seagulls with these 1978 leads on them. I bet Seagull sold them to dealers and they did not scrap them, but sold them!

New lead and cap £16.75 from SOS.

By the way the membrane over the filter is old fuel turning to varnish, a good carb cleaner sorts it!

Water jacket has a way to go yet, worth taking the head off to clear that. when refitting head use new gasket and RTV sealant and allow to set for a couple of hours finger tight, befpore final 17ftlb, or hard hand tight on the bolts.

hope with a new lead and fresh fuel you will hear the bark of that Seagull soon.

Regards,
John
SOS
Shamba
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Re: GFP 40+ starts but won't get going

Post by Shamba »

He he. Yes I was trying to make one on the cheap. Truth be told I didn't even consider or research doing it any other way as that's what I've always done with ht leads (never had a seagull before though). Live and learn.

Speaking of which, RTV on the head gasket? Really? That's a bit unexpected. It can cope with head joint temperature and pressures? Well I guess so or you wouldn't have recommended it :|

Steve
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John@sos
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Re: GFP 40+ starts but won't get going

Post by John@sos »

Hi Steve

Yes British Seagull recommended RTV on all head gaskets and crank halves from 1990 on when they switched to using it in assembly. Takes account of any discrepancies due to corrosion!

worked for me for past 25 years or so!

You can also use it with advantage on corroged gearbox cap gaskets and indeen almost any gasket, not carb!

withstands head temp as Seagulls are well cooled!

Good luck with that Seagull, waiting to hear that it is barking away!

Regards,
John
SOS
headdownarseup
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Re: GFP 40+ starts but won't get going

Post by headdownarseup »

Well said John, although in light of recent conversations with rtv, best not let C.I hear this. Shhh
No complaints from me using rtv . Been using the stuff for years with no problems.


Just a little tip Steve, a small masonary drill works quite well at removing the crud from the waterjacket. Gently though.



Jon
Shamba
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Re: GFP 40+ starts but won't get going

Post by Shamba »

RTV it is then. I was thinking about some "dentistry" with a Dremel-like tool for cleaning out the water jacket galleries. I assume that a masonry bit works by whacking the crud with the spade like tip without any real risk of drilling the casting?

Steve
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