Saving Old Seagulls

Pick the bones out of this one then.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/British-Seagu ... Sw9KtZeRbn

Pressed brass tank mounts, late serial number (1350 away from my SDP), late tank straps, brass tiller with an odd tiller grip, wrong thumb throttle etc. etc. etc. and what's with those colours !!!

Is it REALLY worth that much
I don't think so


Jon

Also the carb looks late, like the throttle lever, no plug cap and a painted tube, a cheap restoration, if it was all original and not tarted up like a French poodle, then it may have been worth more than it is now.

Keith.P wrote:Also the carb looks late, like the throttle lever, no plug cap and a painted tube, a cheap restoration, if it was all original and not tarted up like a French poodle, then it may have been worth more than it is now.

Now i know what a french podded looks like cheers china

You guys aren't making my task of the SD register any easier by running down motors that come on ebay. Remember that the Seagull community is small and SOS is the forum benchmark and hence read by most. Sadly with comments like this by a small minority does reflect badly on SOS. This motor was sold to the current owner a couple of years ago by John Williams.

I remember that engine being on the SOS website, in fact the pics might still be there.

The seller has obviously gone right through the engine, not many people would replace and ream out the crank bushes. It also has a very nice replacement bayonet cap Shame about the description as a naval model, that description has come from here I'm afraid.

With the skeletal bracket, and ignoring the red paint, quite nice. Best of luck to the seller, who has obviously worked hard at it.

I echo Hugo's thoughts.

Sold by John in it's current condition, no doubtful?
Yes, I criticize the overpriced and badly restored motors, whatever make it is and applaud the well restored and original motors.
Or do I have to say: O what a smashing job he has made of this motor, I do hope someone pays the full asking price, as it's worth every penny he is asking.
As you say Hugo, SOS is the forum benchmark for Seagulls, shame the benchmark is not a little higher, too eager to put down posts to put up prices.
If that's all you want from this forum, then to be honest I definitely wont miss it.

Before and after...

Here is the sd from November 2013 http://www.saving-old-seagulls.co.uk/it ... r_sale.htm





Sales blurb.

The flywheel is of the original type and has a copper cover. The gear lever is bronze and it has the bronze skeletal bracket I associate with these models. Bronze exhaust. Steel tank with bayonet fit copper fuel cap, original tank straps.

This motor has come to me from a friend, it was his fathers motor , and he had it since the 1950's. It is not seized, but beyond that internal condition is unknown. Has good compression though. Have not tinkered and have no idea if the coil is still good, but after 70 years or more suspect it is not, but this motor is not for general use, it is a Second World War Museum piece and should be treated as such. It has been stored in a garage for 40 odd years and looks as if someone opened a tin of distemper too close, so has a few splatters of paint on it.! the pinch bolt has been replaced with a nut and bolt, but suspect a collector could restore the thread with a helicoil and refit the correct bolt.

SOLD

Was offered at £250 to an enthusiast or collector to polish up and preserve. Normal price for one polished can be over £400. They do not come up that often, certainly not as complete as this one.

And after, certainly a lot shinier than it once was, the colours won't appeal to everybody, best suited to someone from County Mayo, Ireland.

The photographs.

Before and after...

Is that the same motor?

If it is its a shame in my opinion, i think that engines with patina are nicer to have than restored ones.

Jacob

Hugz wrote:This motor was sold to the current owner a couple of years ago by John Williams.

John Williams who runs Saving old Seagulls and this forum.

Oyster 49 wrote:I remember that engine being on the SOS website, in fact the pics might still be there.

If you scroll down a bit on this link you can see more of the "original" pictures.
http://www.saving-old-seagulls.co.uk/it ... r_sale.htm

I like the novel approaxh of using the original height adjuster as the transom bracket tilt support. I've never quite figured out what the V strut hooks onto on the skeletal brackets.

Does powder coating have a high heat characteristic? Would it burn on the exhaust tube?

Shall i have another more subtle go at this!
Each to their own when it comes to a refurb or restoration. I'm not knocking the guy for that.

What i meant by "picking the bones" was look at the smaller components this is made from, ignore the colour scheme for now.
Going back and forth between the before and after pictures there seems to be a bit that's shall we say changed.
Older pics from SOS show what i believe to be the "original" carb for this motor and yet in the after pics it's a more modern variant with a plastic fuel pipe. It will obviously still run like this but it's not right for the motor's age.
Before pics show the much earlier gearbox oil nipple arrangement, after pics show a more "common" gearbox.(something not quite right there)
Tank straps in the before pics are probably right for this, and yet in the after pics they've been swapped out. On and on it goes.

These sorts of "changes" to an old motor don't make mine or Hugo's job any easier, least of all when Charles is watching.
Paperwork can only tell so much, the rest we can learn from what survives in whatever state it might be in. Case in point with this one, and possibly a few more out there yet to surface.
Originality (or as close to original without destroying the true identity of something) it seems is fast becoming a thing of the past with many of these older motors, and like young Jacob has mentioned a grotty bashed up and battered old motor can tell far more of the story than a pimped up blinged up specimen like this.
Fair play the guy has spent some time and money on this, and probably gone a fair bit further in terms of mechanical restoration than many of us would dare go. Not really my thing, but i notice a lot of things that others might not.

All that glitters isn't golden, no matter how well it's served up.

Sorry guys. Originality speaks volumes in my opinion if we're going to get this right for future generations of budding seagullers.

Jon

Hugo, this is what the components should look like on a skeletal bracket. What's missing on the one from ebay.

When Jon started saying, this and that had been changed, it got me to thinking is this actually the one that John Williams sold in November 2013. Maybe John Williams sold a different SD other than the one in November 2013. If you click on the "John Williams" picture and zoom in, you can just about make out the engine serial number and it looks a lot different to the very bold, well stamped "ebay sd". It could be that the original "John Williams" photo the serial number is just covered in grime and can't me made out properly.

I'm sure Hugz has information in his registry that leads him to believe that it is the same outboard, just making sure we're 100% certain.

"John Williams November 2013" "ebay sd"

Hello all.

It's me that's selling the unrestored Sd on E-Bay. Hugz got in touch with me for more information and I said I will post some more pictures on here for him. I will do this tomorrow when it is light. I have had to re-activate my account, so sorry for the delay.

Kind regards Flakey, Metalflake11 on ebay.

I don't post pictures or discuss some of the more interesting things i have as it seems some just need to pick faults etc I am fully happy that some items wear bettter than others and an upgrade over the years is acceptable I am sure it probably depends on if you need shiny show case engines or a reliable way to get to your lobster pots daily